The Fien Saga

[Go_The_Doggies]

Kiwis threaten pull out over Fien drama

Tuesday, October 31, 2006 - 5:02 AM

The New Zealand rugby league team has threatened to pull out of the Tri-Nations if it is docked points because of Australian-born Nathan Fien's ineligibility to pull on a black jumper.

Fien played his second Test for the Kiwis in an 18-14 win over Great Britain in Christchurch on Saturday night, after it understood his grandmother was born in New Zealand.

International rugby league rules state a player can qualify for a country if any one of his grandparents was born there.

But it has since been revealed it was Fien's great-grandmother who was born in New Zealand, and as such, he is likely to be booted from the competition.

International Federation Boss Colin Love says the Kiwis may have to show cause why they should not lose the points.

"If we lose our points then Great Britain needn't bother showing up to Wellington (on Saturday) week because we certainly won't be there," NZRL executive chairman Selwyn Bennett told the Daily Telegraph.
Source: AAP

BTW Sel Bennett has backed down from this threat, saying it was in the heat of the moment, blah blah blah.

I still think he is a complete tool, and only sounded like a bigger one on radiosport this morning.

[Poida]

BTW Sel Bennett has backed down from this threat, saying it was in the heat of the moment, blah blah blah.

I still think he is a complete tool, and only sounded like a bigger one on radiosport this morning.

what did he say?

[Grimmace]

Well i have talked to a few GB fans who arent happy campers ATM just by reading a few things on foxsports they feel like they have been cheated.
My question why was this not picked up in the begginning.

[Coaster]

Ahh the Kiwis are cheating and the Poms are whinging and the Aussies are undefeated.

The world is back in order :win:

[Steelers]

If the Kiwis lose their points, I would defend their move to abandon the competition if thats what they did. There is no way that the Kiwis should be punished for this IMO.

[Meh]

Ahh the Kiwis are cheating and the Poms are whinging and the Aussies are undefeated.

The world is back in order :win:

Jesus can the Aussies please stop trying to strip the kiwis of points? do they all of the sudden feel threatened and need to start stripping kiwis over things that could be settled with a nice hefty fine?

[Titanium_BD1103]

LOL Meh... if only the NZRL was smart enough not to make complete idiots of themselves then the ARL would....

This is just embarrassing, I mean c'mon trying to cheat just to win a game... that is embarassing and sad, it's not wrong because IMO if a person can play if their grandparents come from that country, then why not the Great Grandparents.

I reckon the whole rule is stupid anyway, you should only be able to play for the country you are born in, or if any leeway your parents are born in.

This has created an embarrassment not just for NZ but for the whole of Rugby League now... and it wasn't ever needed.

[patrick]

Ahh the Kiwis are cheating and the Poms are whinging and the Aussies are undefeated.

The world is back in order :win:

:lol!:

I reckon it's a joke, but I can live with it.
I don't think Fien should be playing for NZ, but i hope they do not lose any points. Fien wouldn't have been picked for Australia anyway. Sure Willie Mason and Karmichael Hunt have NZ backgrounds, but they have not played for another country, in any way, that's other than Australia. Fien's played for Australia (in Origin) and for NZ.
You should not play for a certain country because of your grandparents. :sick:

I was just thinking, what if NZ offered Steve Price a go with them, because he plays for the Warriors and has lived there for a few years now. That would be terrible.

[DIEHARD]

Had Wally Lewis' sticking up for the Kiwis today, saying that the Kangaroos have some dubious selections of New Zealand stock as well.

But hopefully all this intense media critisism will convince the league bosses to take this type of thing seriously.

I hope that NZ are not stripped of points, we don't need this circus to escalate. Just kick Fien out of the Tri Nations. fine New Zealand and let's get on with business.

[DIEHARD]

LEWIS CALLS FOR 'STRONG PENALTY'

Rugby league bosses have unlimited powers to deal with New Zealand over the "Grannygate" affair which is threatening to turn the Tri-Nations drama into a full-blown crisis.

On Wednesday evening the Tri-Nations sub-committee will re-convene their deliberations into allegations that the Kiwis fielded an ineligible player in their 18-14 win over Great Britain in Christchurch last Saturday.

New Zealand have admitted that Australian-born hooker Nathan Fien's qualification is based on a great-grandmother rather than a grandmother which, in the opinion of British supremo Richard Lewis, makes for a prima facie case.

"It seems pretty clear to me that an ineligible player has been played in that match," said the RFL executive chairman, who is a member of the three-strong sub-committee. "To most neutral observers that would be unchallengable.

"It's a question of what the penalty should be and that hasn't been discussed yet. Definitely we feel there has been a serious breach of the rules.

"My feeling is that a very strong penalty should be imposed."

New Zealand have been given until Wednesday morning to make a written submission to the Tri-Nations executive and justify their selection of the Queensland-born Fien.

The Tri-Nations sub-committee - Selwyn Bennett, of New Zealand, and Australia's Colin Love are the other members - will then re-establish their conference call at 9.30pm to determine a resolution of the potentially damaging affair.

Fien looks likely to be thrown out of the tournament and New Zealand could even be docked the points gained from their win over the Lions.

"The rules don't stipulate the options," added Lewis. "Basically the sub-committee can take whatever action if feels is appropriate. The powers are wide-ranging."

Lewis, who does not fly out to Australia until next Wednesday, said he was unmoved by threats from New Zealand to take legal action and to boycott their next match against Great Britain in Wellington if the points are awarded to the Lions.

"It's completely irrelevant," he said. "It's a threat and we don't respond to threats."

Fien, who was called into the New Zealand squad following the withdrawal of David Solomona, made his debut as a substitute in the Kiwis' 20-15 defeat by Australia in Melbourne and started Saturday's match against the Lions at hooker.

He spent four seasons with North Queensland Cowboys before joining New Zealand Warriors two years ago and, unlike full-back Brent Webb, does not qualify on residency grounds.

Source: SKY SPORTS

[Grimmace]

Fien offers to fall on sword to save Kiwis
Brad Walter
November 1, 2006

NATHAN Fien is prepared to stand down from the rest of the Tri-Nations in what is almost certain to prove a futile bid to save New Zealand from being stripped of competition points.

But the Kiwis may use the "Grannygate" scandal to argue for the international constitution to be enforced to ensure clubs release their players for Test duty.

NZRL lawyers will outline legal arguments for why Fien is eligible to play for the Kiwis even though it was his great-grandmother that was born in New Zealand - not his grandmother - in written submissions to be forwarded to the International Federation executive by 3pm today.

But Kiwis officials will also concede there had been a misunderstanding over Fien's New Zealand heritage when he made himself available for selection and insist neither they nor the former Queensland Origin hooker set out to deceive, but made a simple error.

It is understood the possibility that the birth certificate Fien presented as his "Nan's" may have really been that of his Wanganui-born great-grandmother first emerged last week in the lead-up to New Zealand's Test against Great Britain in Christchurch.

Until then, NZRL officials and coach Brian McClennan had believed it was his grandmother and forwarded a copy to the ARL after naming him to make his Test debut in Melbourne the week before. The Kiwis accept that Fien had never differentiated between his grandmother and great-grandmother and reported yesterday that the 27-year-old Warriors hooker, who has a New Zealand-born daughter, was devastated by the prospect he might have cost the team its points and has offered to stand down.

A decision on whether New Zealand has breached section 3.1(B) of the RLIF constitution that says "a player is eligible to play for the country in which either of his parents or any of his grandparents was born" will be made tomorrow, with the Kiwis expected to be docked two points and Fien suspended from the New Zealand team until next year when he qualifies on residency grounds.

But the NZRL maintains the international eligibility regulations were not drafted tightly enough to mean only grandparentage, not great-grandparentage.

"We just want it clarified," NZRL chairman Selwyn Bennett told the Herald last night. "When you look at the international constitution it is very unclear about player eligibility and we believe the whole thing needs cleaning up. But we never set out to deceive anyone, it's just an innocent mistake.

"Nathan referred to her as his Nan and he told us that he knew her. After we found out, I referred to her as his great-grandmother in a TV interview last Sunday. I had nothing to hide. After reading the constitution, I didn't think it made any difference anyway." With NRL clubs refusing all but a few requests to release players for July's Test against Great Britain in England, Kiwis officials have been well versed in the wording of the RLIF constitution and have been looking for an opportunity to raise issues of player availability and neutral referees.

Few Super League-based players were available for this season's Anzac Test and McClennan was unable to use prop Jason Cayless and utility Motu Tony in the opening two matches of the Tri-Nations tournament.

Section 4 of the RLIF constitution, headed "Availability for International Rugby League", states that "a player who has been selected to play a senior international match approved as such by the board:

■ Must be made available by his club for all such matches;

■ Shall not play for his club or any other team in the period of five days before;

■ Shall not withdraw from a match without the approval of the [country] which has selected him; and,

■ In the event of withdrawing after selection shall not be permitted to play for his club ? in the period commencing five days prior to and ending five days after such a match he has been selected."

Bennett said: "They're pulling one section of the constitution on us for one thing and yet you go to the next section and that isn't being enforced."

Source:smh

[Grimmace]

Stuart blasts rattled rivals
By Dean Ritchie
November 01, 2006

AUSTRALIA coach Ricky Stuart yesterday dived into the continuing Nathan Fien fiasco by declaring: "I'd be embarrassed if I was a New Zealand player."

The humiliated NZRL will supply a written submission to the International Federation telling why it should not be docked two Tri-Nations points earned by beating Great Britain.

NZRL chairman Selwyn Bennett had a phone conference with the International Federation executive committee yesterday.

The Kiwis were told to submit their document this afternoon.

A Tri-Nations sub-committee will consider the NZRL submission and reconvene tomorrow to determine Fien's eligibility and any consequences that may flow from that decision.

New Zealand could escape with a fine or caution while Fien is likely to be kicked out of the Tri-Nations for being ineligible to represent New Zealand.

Great Britain players yesterday asked that New Zealand not be deducted their two points but Stuart spoke his mind.

"The rules should be tightened and they should be more professional about it," Stuart said.

"But if they (New Zealand) have elected to put an Australian in their national team, that's their decision.

"It's an embarrassment to New Zealand having to pick an Australian player.

"I'd be very embarrassed if I was a Kiwi player - and the fact they probably knew it before he took the field. That is the most embarrassing part of it."

Stuart urged the Tri-Nations committee to quickly decide whether they would penalise New Zealand their two points.

Tongue-in-cheek, Stuart said: "I hope they hurry up and make their decision.

"We've got a final in a couple of weeks and we might be able to bring it forward."

It is understood Fien was urged to play for New Zealand by some members of his inner-circle.

The Daily Telegraph can also reveal Fien approached New Zealand coach Brian McClennan mid-year about the possibility of representing New Zealand.

McClennan told Fien he would have to show documents proving he was eligible.

Fien said his "nan" was a New Zealander.

He did not say his "nan" was his great-grandmother and not his grandmother.

New Zealand selector Darrell Williams hoped Fien would not deliberately lie about his relatives.

"I'd be disappointed if he has duped us," said Williams, a former Kiwi Test centre and fullback.

"I don't think he has. I don't think it's in him to be an out-and-out liar. It was a silly and stupid mistake."

ARL chief executive Geoff Carr revealed yesterday his organisation had sent a letter to the NZRL on October 19 questioning Fien's eligibility.

"We expressed concerns over where he qualified," Carr said. "We asked for evidence and needed some proof. They wrote back the same day with his grandmother's birth certificate attached, saying it made him eligible.

"Once we questioned it and got that answer, there was really no place to take it. We had to accept the information we were given."

TAB Sportsbet yesterday suspended betting on the Tri-Nations over the Fien drama.

Bennett had threatened to withdraw New Zealand from the tournament if his team's points were deducted.

But Bennett yesterday backed down, saying his comments were made "in the heat of the battle".
Source: Daily Telegraph

[RIP]

I think MM was meaning that Fien shouldnt have been picked in the first place, and i have to agree with him there. But once you play for a country, i reckon whats done is done and thats who u play for for your whole career, and i hope thats what Fien is going to do.

If thats the case Willie Mason would be playing for Tonga since he played in the world cup 2000 for them. & since Karmiachael Hunt played for the junior kiwis dose that make him play for the kiwis. & don't forget the best, The Cayless bros. They were born in Sydney. What about DALLY MESSAGER he played for the kiwis yet his an aussie. & if this little war keeps goin what about origin level Peter Sterling would of played for QLD & Micheal Crocker will play for NSW & Karmiachael Hunt would play with him self. Greg Inglis playing for NSW this is a so stupid. IMO they should play for who they wish.

[Poida]

LOL Meh... if only the NZRL was smart enough not to make complete idiots of themselves then the ARL would....

This is just embarrassing, I mean c'mon trying to cheat just to win a game... that is embarassing and sad, it's not wrong because IMO if a person can play if their grandparents come from that country, then why not the Great Grandparents.

I reckon the whole rule is stupid anyway, you should only be able to play for the country you are born in, or if any leeway your parents are born in.

This has created an embarrassment not just for NZ but for the whole of Rugby League now... and it wasn't ever needed.

i agree. i never liked the rule of it having to be grandparent. i think it should be if u have any kiwiw blood at all. but at the same time providing you dont play state of origin

[Pale Ale Panther]

I find it hard to understand how someone that has played State of Origin for QLD can represent New Zealand, if that is true the Fien should have been automatically disqualified from representing NZ.cya.

and then to play for Australia and Qld again ? Mr T. Carroll ! :noidea: :noidea:

look, the guy lives in NZ, his daughter was born there, he was never going to play for Australia, :yell: LET HIM PLAY :yell: i do agree you should be only able to play International football for one country, roll this around in your head aswell, a way around the whole Origin thing is to let the Kiwi boys play origin ? then the likes of Hunt and Tahu could still play for NZ ? just a thought..............