2022 Season General Discussion Thread

[gotitans101_]

Payten was not a rookie coach at NQ

He was in his first year at the Warriors. Did you see them play that year? They surprised everyone. Half of their side went home to be with their families halfway through the year.

[Firetruck]

A couple of quick points:-

1. Watched the Tweed v Capra’s game this arvo and after only 8 minutes into the game, Sam Lisone was blowing like a porn star. Says a lot about fitness levels when a NRL player goes back to Reggie’s and is stuffed in the first few minutes.

2. While JH has to wear the consequences of poor selection decisions this year, we should not lose sight of the fact that the Immortal is responsible for performance and culture; both of which have been graded an “F.”

3. Apparently on ABC radio, a commentator mentioned that he was discussing the mess known as the Titans with a league “great” and the league great ( don’t know who because I didn’t listen..was told second hand) said that Clarke was the major problem due to his slow, poor service and his shocking defence. He apparently went on to say that if all the coaches ranked all the hookers in the competition, Clarke would end up at 16..and that has contributed to Sexton playing like a busted. I personally think that the issues are wider than one or two players. And why was I not surprised at the post-match video grab that showed JH talking to a small group of player, including JWal. Was JWal listening intently? Nup. He was texting on his phone.

[RavShamrock]

Hey Ft great points
thanks man

[Whats Doing]

One of the biggest problems at the Titans has been Ezra Howe and his Congo line of substandard recruits.

The only shining light has been Jamie McCormack and his JTS program

[coreythompson]

When we first signed Corey Thompson he was playing at fullback and he was electrifying

And then we put AJ Brimson back their and dropped Corey Thompson from the whole team

And then put Corey Thompson back on the wing

Corey is a fullback

People say he don't have enough height

Everytime he match up with Daniel Tupou, Tupou never owns Thompson,
Thompson holds his own


And how many times I say in this forum Mitch Rein is a boss
He is killing it in the eels

He just got resigned

When I said sack Holbrook everyone think I am trolling
Now everyone say where Thompson, where Rein, where Garth Brennan

[Mexican titan]

A couple of quick points:-

Clarke was the major problem due to his slow, poor service and his shocking defence. He apparently went on to say that if all the coaches ranked all the hookers in the competition, Clarke would end up at 16..and that has contributed to Sexton playing like a busted.

Clarke would be lower than 16th as there are some clubs have two better hookers in their 17.

[The Birdman]

Clarke would be lower than 16th as there are some clubs have two better hookers in their 17.

Yet Holbrook has blindly kept selecting him week after week. Its infuriating that he can't figure out he needs to give someone else an opportunity.

A few clubs might even have 3 hookers better than Clark.

[Whats Doing]

CM Article

NRL 2022: The Gold Coast Titans blunders that cost Justin Holbrook

Justin Holbrook has been let down by the Titans’ shambolic roster management, including the farcical David Fifita signing, writes David Ricco.


Justin Holbrook has been let down by the Titans’ shambolic roster management.

Any situation that leads a room full of decision-makers to pay a backrower $1.2 million is farcical.

Holbrook’s ability to field a well-balanced side each week has been hamstrung by the salary of David Fifita.

Fifita has averaged just under 12 runs per-game in 2022.

You do the maths on how much value the Titans are getting out of Fifita and more importantly, their salary cap.


Instead of pouring at least half of that $1.2m into an elite-level hooker, they’ve been running around with great respect, the simply solid $120,000 Erin Clark.

The decision to let the steady-hand of Jamal Fogarty go to the Raiders at the end of last season, only for the Titans management to then realise that they indeed miss an experienced head in the halves, that they then sign Kieran Foran, who will be 33 halfway next year, is astonishing.

Front-rower Isaac Liu is a strong player. But is he worth upwards of $550,000 in the final years of his career?

Jarrod Wallace has been a terrible buy.

He ran around on Friday night in Newcastle like a player that couldn’t care less about his coach or his club.

He ran three times for 26-metres and was sent-off.

Instead of structuring a salary cap focused on their matchwinners in the spine, the Titans have invested the majority of their cash in their pack with the likes of Tino Fa‘asuamaleaui, Moeaki Fotuaika, Wallace and Fifita.

Because of this flawed cap structure, the Titans went into 2022 banking on AJ Brimson transitioning from fullback to half.

That move was seemingly aborted in round eight, when he was shifted back to the fullback spot.

Will Smith, Paul Turner and Toby Sexton have all been tried as combinations in the halves.

When your halves are on such high rotation, what does that tell the Titans management?

Sacking Holbrook is an easier solution for the Titans.

But it’s their recruitment model that needs to be ripped apart.

WHY THE TITANS NEED TO APPOINT A COACH WITH PREMIERSHIP SUCCESS

The Titans is not a job for a rookie coach. They’ve tried that before and failed. What they have never had is a premiership winning coach take charge of the side. Never in their history.

Think Justin Holbrook and Garth Brennan. Holbrook’s stint has lasted one more season than his predecessor Brennan’s ill-fated two years in control at the club which ended during the 2019 season.

Before them veteran mentor Neil Henry had a crack and looked on the verge of success before Jarryd Hayne’s arrival in 2016 brought down some of the good work which was happening. Henry was gone a year later.

The club’s inaugural coach John Cartwright enjoyed a purple patch early but he too lacked what has followed him and that is a coach who has won an NRL premiership.
The Titans have picked rookie coaches before and failed. They need an premiership winner like Shane Flanagan, writes Michael Carayannis.
The Titans have picked rookie coaches before and failed. They need an premiership winner like Shane Flanagan, writes Michael Carayannis. Picture: Getty Images.

The Titans have little option but to appoint either Shane Flanagan or Paul Green to the job. The duo – along with Michael Maguire – are the premiership winning coaches on the market. Flanagan should be the main man although the appeal of appointing a Queenslander could sway the Titans management in his favour.

Maguire and the club flirted once before – in 2018 – before Brennan’s appointment.

This time around though the club should land on Flanagan’s feet. He knows what it is like to build a club up. He took over the Sharks when the club was on its knees and turned them into a premiership force. He has something no other coaching candidate has – an ability to attract decorated senior players. Think Luke Lewis, James Maloney and Michael Ennis while identifying a crop of untapped talent such as Andrew Fifita, Wade Graham, Matt Prior and Sam Tagataese and helping turn them into premiership winning representative players.

[NZFan]

Apparently on ABC radio, a commentator mentioned that he was discussing the mess known as the Titans with a league “great” and the league great ( don’t know who because I didn’t listen..was told second hand) said that Clarke was the major problem due to his slow, poor service and his shocking defence. He apparently went on to say that if all the coaches ranked all the hookers in the competition, Clarke would end up at 16..and that has contributed to Sexton playing like a busted.

This is why I feel sorry for Sexton. He was an Australian schoolboys player coming through the grades and had massive potential. I don't actually think that he has played badly this year. His defence has been solid, his short kicking game decent and he has a long punt on him. Sure he's not the fastest 7 going round and needs to do some sprint training but to lump the blame on a young half with no help around him is unfair.

Watching the game on Friday the Knights had it figured out (much like every other team we've played this year), slow the fifth play tackle down and get out of marker to put pressure on the kicker because he would have slow service and no other option to pass to. It's not just Clarke's service that is poor it is the whole teams. Every player in the backline should know how to pass from the ground efficiently but there's not one player out there that can. Tanah's technique overall is much better than Clarke's but he slips into bad habits when he is fatigued and gets a bit lost with communication so throws the odd bad pass here and there. He is still learning the position so I can't be too critical, whereas Clarke has played plenty of hooker over the last two seasons and hasn't improved at all. Clarke's body language shows that he is contempt in his game. I bet if you asked him he'd say that he's been playing well.

I'm not in the sack Holbrook camp just yet but if he doesn't dump some of these players next round then he's as good as made his bed. Holbrook needs to take some pressure off Sexton. Bring Booth in as starting hooker and instruct him to kick at least once a half on tackle 3 or 4. It's too easy to put pressure on Sexton when everyone knows what's coming. Put AJ back at 6 and give them time to develop their combination with a hooker who won't cramp their attack with bad service. If we are to be any sort of threat next year the AJ/Fafita combination needs to be firing. Put Beau out with Toby on the right to get some chatter up. While I believe Fermor is a better left edge than right, that's Dave's position and he needs to play 80 there. Piss Herbert and Isaako off for good and bring Jojo and Thompson in. I don't think that Jojo is actually ready yet but he'll have to learn on the job. At least he'd have Fermor and Thompson there that he can listen to (we all know that Herbert never listened and look how that turned out).

One more game for Holbrook. If he make the same mistakes again then he deserves to be booted. Does anyone know where Sami is?

[Upthetits]

Great post, agree with everything you said nzfan

[Just-a-Fan]

I think we need to put some blame on the players to many time we use the coach as the way out .
Don't get me wrong I am all for our juniors coming in and giving us the edge but honestly who out of our juniors have really taken the NRL by the throat
Ok I know I will up set many a person on here ad I can not write for life of me but I try get my point across
AJ really has done nothing this year ok he played in 6 and not 1 but is at 1 now still nothing a year ago he go into the QLD side
I know he bleed our colours but really when it get tough out here he folds
BK is another 1 that has not done what he can do just errors after errors or missed tackles
Our forwards as in a mess Mo has been consistence but get put on the bench always make over the 100meters and 30 tackle and only 1 or maybe 2 misses LUI has done nothing to help bring the extra what was needed for the roster he had aggression now he is a puffy pander
I can not say Fifita has been bad just doesn't do it for me I would sooner swap Him for Haas
Lisone this has been given a different role in my eye he told to be a ball plyer not a back fence runner onto the ball type player
Wallace is just a Dic-head think he is better then he is and upset everyone in the team
Fermor has been good but think he needs more ball sorry Better Ball has pace and size and some ability
Turner has been good for short amount of time I believe Boyd want to be a half still but has lost that chance
Our hooker is no-way a NRL level player but get picked every week sorry I been trying to put him in the side at lock but honestly he would fail that as well I think Booth would do a better job
Herbert to me has played his heart out for the club and get put down weekly for missing tackles WTF he has no one inside of him that he can rely on last week have a look how different he played with Fermor inside him I rate a s a winger not a center
and way we are never going to improve with this standard of Player we have no back boke at all fold under pressure and always will
I think we need to look out side out back yard and get player that bring something to the club

[Boonarga]

And why was I not surprised at the post-match video grab that showed JH talking to a small group of player, including JWal. Was JWal listening intently? Nup. He was texting on his phone.

That, to me, is grounds for removal from the team. I've been an advocate of Wallace but that is disgraceful disrespect from a supposed 'leader'. Plus, i don't believe that tackle was accidental.

[NZTITAN]

CM Article

NRL 2022: The Gold Coast Titans blunders that cost Justin Holbrook

Justin Holbrook has been let down by the Titans’ shambolic roster management, including the farcical David Fifita signing, writes David Ricco.


Justin Holbrook has been let down by the Titans’ shambolic roster management.

Any situation that leads a room full of decision-makers to pay a backrower $1.2 million is farcical.

Holbrook’s ability to field a well-balanced side each week has been hamstrung by the salary of David Fifita.

Fifita has averaged just under 12 runs per-game in 2022.

You do the maths on how much value the Titans are getting out of Fifita and more importantly, their salary cap.


Instead of pouring at least half of that $1.2m into an elite-level hooker, they’ve been running around with great respect, the simply solid $120,000 Erin Clark.

The decision to let the steady-hand of Jamal Fogarty go to the Raiders at the end of last season, only for the Titans management to then realise that they indeed miss an experienced head in the halves, that they then sign Kieran Foran, who will be 33 halfway next year, is astonishing.

Front-rower Isaac Liu is a strong player. But is he worth upwards of $550,000 in the final years of his career?

Jarrod Wallace has been a terrible buy.

He ran around on Friday night in Newcastle like a player that couldn’t care less about his coach or his club.

He ran three times for 26-metres and was sent-off.

Instead of structuring a salary cap focused on their matchwinners in the spine, the Titans have invested the majority of their cash in their pack with the likes of Tino Fa‘asuamaleaui, Moeaki Fotuaika, Wallace and Fifita.

Because of this flawed cap structure, the Titans went into 2022 banking on AJ Brimson transitioning from fullback to half.

That move was seemingly aborted in round eight, when he was shifted back to the fullback spot.

Will Smith, Paul Turner and Toby Sexton have all been tried as combinations in the halves.

When your halves are on such high rotation, what does that tell the Titans management?

Sacking Holbrook is an easier solution for the Titans.

But it’s their recruitment model that needs to be ripped apart.

Christ. I'll address the bold points.

1. I tend to agree that Holbrook has been let down by some roster decisions, sure. But David Riccio, like most casual NRL fans, actually didn't hit anywhere close to the target of what our issues are imo, address a couple of them, sure, but I really think our issues are much deeper than roster management. Lack of professionalism, toughness, leadership and other intangibles have sunk this team, with one of the most glaring weaknesses in terms of the roster itself being mainly the lack of mobile defensive minded forwards, guys like Lisone and Jolliffe are fine at a pinch but get repeatedly cooked up the middle. I also think there has been a massive decline in form from probably half of the starting 17; C Thompson, Kelly, Herbert, Fotuaika, Wallace, D Fifita, Lisone, Jolliffe, McIntyre among others. Wether that's Holbrook's fault, i'm not so sure.

One of the things the Titans have done very well in the past is find low-level guys and juice the last bit of talent and usefulness out of them, the big issues have been when the Titans have kept these guys that were once bargain buys and decided to extend them with the optimism that they will continue their form. Not to mention over-playing those same players, Erin Clark, for example was an incredible bargain buy on a Train & Trial deal that is really now a bench 17 that can play 13 and #9 at a pinch (Very good value for a guy who was going to play for Point Chev Pirates before he came over). However, Erin Clark as a long-term, even stand-in 9 is over-playing him as far as his actual talent goes.

2. D Fifita has underperformed, he's also been injured, and has also received some of the more bog standard service from his halves this season, he still scored 16 damn tries for us last year and is a gamebreaker when he is on, it was still a cracker signing, but he isnt being used right, and I wish he would go looking for work more.

3. Yeah, just go ahead and throw 1.2M at a Hooker, easy as that, oh, actually, how many decent hookers are there available? Yeah, thought so, easier said than done. I would prefer a high quality 9 but it seems there is a massive lack in hooker talent around the League and teams very rarely let those types of guys walk. We were in the market for B Smith, close but no cigar.

4. Jamal Fogarty, for those that actually watched him, another terrific bargain buy that looked decent on an over-achieving 2020 Titans side, but was a bottom tier starting halfback with a very low ceiling, and frustrating 5th tackle options on a 2021 side that was competing for something. But yeah, for those that didnt watch him he was the savior of the GC, Scott Prince 2.0.

5. Isaac Liu is not a problem, he and Tino are getting basically zero support defensively up the middle.

6. Jarrod Wallace was bought for the 2017 season, but anyway, another player that ended up giving the team pretty decent value and looked to be a quality prop at times, most if not all of his value has been squeezed out of him and it's clear his mind is on the Dolphins. Not big deal.

7. No, it was because Jayden Campbell was really good last year, like c'mon.

8. The Recruitment model does need to be ripped apart, but not because of David Fifita, Jamal Fogarty or Erin Clark. I've said it before but this team has it's 'top tier talent' set, and even it's deep bench guys, but the role players we need to support the top-tier guys are just not there, and even if they were, the fit is awful and theyre not ticking off any of the boxes I mentioned earlier (professionalism, toughness, defensive mobility etc).

Sign more Zeb Taia's and Chris McQueen's.

[NZFan]

My thoughts as well NZT. The fact is Fafita has been injured this year and has been bumped around positions while his inside halves have also chopped and changed. The injury to Campbell has had a far bigger impact than anything that Fogarty would have brought to the table. I was and am still happy to have let Fogarty go.

We need leaders that are not only smart but can also talk. It doesn’t seem like we have anyone out there that is vocal on the field apart from Wallace and the stuff coming out of his mouth isn’t clever.

[jacksonm]

Liu is not the problem but as a recruit he has been a dud, no impact with or without the ball. Cut him loose now