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Thread: Gold Coast Suns

  1. #46
    Administrator DIEHARD's Avatar
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    I can go on...

    AFL invest in stadiums, with a long term goal of strategic control
    NRL pays rent

    AFL own a radio station and have non-exclusive radio rights
    NRL give exclusive rights to 2GB

    AFL give salary cap exemptions to fast track success to frontier clubs (Lions 3 Premierships, Swans 1. 4 this century)
    NRL give new teams and frontier teams no help

    AFL get the gravy off Fox Sports
    NRL made Fox Sports

    AFL have a united national brand from auskicks to AFL
    NRL have several brands and authorities in charge of grassroots

    AFL take games overseas and actually do try to grow the game as ridiculous as it is, AFL clubs toe the line
    NRL (rugby league) has a proper international tier but NRL clubs and fans canibalise it

    AFL has a compliced Melbourne media who cover stuff up
    NRL has a blood thirsty Sydney media who can smell blood

    AFL fans cheer for their club
    NRL fans support the game
    PUT EM TO THE SWORD! SHOW SOME STEEL!

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  2. #47
    Coach Coaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIEHARD View Post
    I can go on...



    AFL fans cheer for their club
    NRL fans support the game

    Actually i think this is the other way around.

    It plsses me off to think of the hard work Searle and Co. have done for the Titans, and how little the Suns have done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Titus View Post
    When I am unable to respect and accept the decisions that are being made that directly affect my team, then I must take a backwards step.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    The main difference between the AFL and NRL.
    AFL spend millions on a team before they start
    NRL expect them to be self reliant day one

    AFL use there power to persuade government
    NRL let the new club do all the work themselves

    AFL pour unlimited funds into the new team
    NRL announce to papers if a new team asks for a advance

    AFL give massive cap concessions
    NRL fine 76k for being less than 5k over the cap

    AFL take control of the stadium
    NRL won't lift a finger

    AFL clubs all support the new team
    NRL clubs try and derail it

    AFL give favorable calls to the new team
    NRL crack down on there tactics

    AFL fans celebrate the new team
    NRL fans ridicule the new team

    AFL spend millions on good news stories
    NRL owners run a smear campaign against a new team

    I could go on
    The AFL spend millions on areas they want to take over. Have a look at 1997 and compare the advantages Brisbane Lions were given compared to Port Adelaide (both entered in 1997). The reason being they wanted a successful brand in Queensland, South Australia didn't matter because it was and still is AFL territory. I'm not sure what you were doing back in 2001-2004 but I remember the Lions getting quite a bit of support from people in South East Queensland. To further my point research into history and look into what happened to the Fitzroy Football Club(defunct Victorian club) at the end of 1996, I assure you if the AFL wanted to save them they could have.

    You are right, the NRL expects teams to be fully self sufficient from day one. I guess that is why so many NRL teams have gone under Newtown, North Sydney, Gold Coast Giants, Gold Coast Chargers, Gold Coast Seagulls, Adelaide Rams(Proof the NRL can't expand into other parts of Australia, I'll go into this travesty if you want me to?), Perth Reds(another example of not being able to expand), South QLD, Hunter Mariners. Then you have all the teams they have had to merge I mean the list goes on and on. In the AFL there has been one merger and one team go under (Melbourne University were never going to survive anyway).

    You want to tell me the Gold Coast Titans fully funded Skilled Park and the Centre of Ex?, get your hand off it mate the Titans have received more assistance from the QLD Government then the Suns have. Unlimited is not quite the right word for the funds the Suns receive, they get $20m from the AFL, 9.2m of which goes straight into the players hands. So essentially they are getting somewhere between 8-10m (after staff costs) a year to do community work and you are saying this is a bad thing?

    In terms of an NRL team having to declare to newspapers when they ask for some cash look into what is currently happening in the AFL to Port Adelaide. It has been highly publicised in Australian media that Port Adeliade is going to receive $9m from the AFL over the next 3 years. In terms of actually being forced to announce that sort of stuff to the media then I guess that is what happens when News Limited owns 50% of your competition!

    The cap exceptions for the Gold Coast Suns this year is merely 1.6m extra that will decrease over the next few years until they are on par with the rest of the AFL clubs. Western Sydney is going to follow the same structure next year so really I don't think that is a huge advantage to a team that is only allowed to sign at maximum 16 players with previous AFL experience. Imagine what the Titans would be like if over 60% of their players in their first year had never played in the NRL before. In terms of going over the cap have you even researched this? Brisbane Lions were fined $21k this year for being over the cap this year. St George were only fined $15k for their breach so the fines vary in both codes.

    The Council owns Carrara Stadium not the AFL. It is true the AFL has a huge pull over stadiums such as the MCG but there is a reason the AFL finishes in early October, the Cricket season begins and in case you didn't know the Melbourne Cricket Club owns the MCG. In terms of the NRL clubs not lifting a finger to build a stadium that is probably why Skilled Park is so terribly built and does not reach international standards to host even a FIFA match. Oh also the stadium would basically have to be demolished to increase the size because of the way it has been built, oops.

    I can't really see an issue with AFL clubs supporting each other, from their point of view the better product they provide the more money all of them make. Favorable calls? what are these favorable calls you speak of? If you watch the Collingwood v Suns match I guarantee you will think the umpires were being paid off by Collingwood with some of the calls they were coping. Watch some of the other AFL games where people have received suspensions for sling tackles and such, which is one of many things the AFL has cracked down on recently. I really think you need to do more research mate.

    Celebration should be in order to a team that can successfully start up and compete week to week in the AFL. It is not an easy thing to do and we are seeing it this year with the Suns really struggling to keep up. I remember when the Titans started and lots of people outside of the GC were excited, including the NRL itself. Again NRL is owned by News Limited, they are thirsty blood sucking vultures that will do anything to get a buck. Controversy causes cash and in this case News Limited have a foot in the door by already owning 50% of the competition. The AFL tries to steer clear of being associated with media outlets from a business stand point but they are not immune either, the whole St Kilda school girl thing really tarnished the code a fair bit.

    After assessing everything you have said here I come to the conclusion that you haven't researched enough to know what you are talking about and you have a warped view in what is really going on. Then again you probably think the Titans are going fine pulling 12,000 (almost definitely less than reported) people a week and being owned by two separate entities which will never publish how the team are going financially. Do your research and come back with some real arguments.

    I just want to also point out I went to the Titans-Broncos first game this year at Skilled Park and then attended the Suns-Lions game later in the year and I can safely say the atmosphere at the AFL game was much better. Maybe you should give the Suns a go, your kids will be if they go through the school system here because of Auskick, a truly genius idea to win over the public from the kids upwards. Maybe the NRL will learn one day and introduce a junior program for kids that offers the sorts of stuff Auskick does. Maybe even a draft system too? So teams like the Brisbane Broncos don't sign every good player at the age of 15. I guess a rugby league fan can always dream.....

  4. #49
    Coach Coaster's Avatar
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    Wow , what an essay, looks like you have your head well and truly `brainwashed congrats. Must be good to be a nice sheep and follow the company line.

    Lets get started with this crap shall we.


    Quote Originally Posted by Titan_Matchu View Post
    The AFL spend millions on areas they want to take over. Have a look at 1997 and compare the advantages Brisbane Lions were given compared to Port Adelaide (both entered in 1997). The reason being they wanted a successful brand in Queensland,
    Are you talking about the 3 premierships they were given?
    I couldnt watch a sport that is no better then the WWE. They stack the deck in favor of these so called expansion team so that they have success, how does that effect other AFL supporters from other clubs? Do you whinge about it, or just lap it up because Sir Vlad says so?



    To further my point research into history and look into what happened to the Fitzroy Football Club(defunct Victorian club) at the end of 1996, I assure you if the AFL wanted to save them they could have.
    Are you talking about the Lions? The same team that still exists today in Brisbane? The same team that was handed 3 premierships to keep there support base happy? and to drum up this massive following in Brisbane and capture all the kids imaginations? WTF happened?

    You are right, the NRL expects teams to be fully self sufficient from day one. I guess that is why so many NRL teams have gone under Newtown, North Sydney, Gold Coast Giants, Gold Coast Chargers, Gold Coast Seagulls, Adelaide Rams(Proof the NRL can't expand into other parts of Australia, I'll go into this travesty if you want me to?), Perth Reds(another example of not being able to expand), South QLD, Hunter Mariners.
    Good work! a whole paragraph of teams and not 1 NRL team

    In the AFL there has been one merger and one team go under (Melbourne University were never going to survive anyway).
    South Melbourne relocated to Sydney Swans
    Brisbane Bears Merged with the Fitzroy Lions
    who the f*ck is Melbourne university?
    Such massive expansion into 2 of the top 3 biggest markets in Australia, relocation of Melbourne teams.


    You want to tell me the Gold Coast Titans fully funded Skilled Park and the Centre of Ex?
    Care to point me where i said Titans funded Skilled park?


    ,
    get your hand off it mate the Titans have received more assistance from the QLD Government then the Suns have.
    Bullsh*t!
    Care to explain


    Unlimited is not quite the right word for the funds the Suns receive, they get $20m from the AFL, 9.2m of which goes straight into the players hands.
    Does that figure include the extra funds given to players like Hunt?

    The cap exceptions for the Gold Coast Suns this year is merely 1.6m extra that will decrease over the next few years until they are on par with the rest of the AFL clubs.
    Again does this include extra payments given to guys like Hunt? NO!
    Also how many extra draft picks do they get?
    If your too stupid to see the AFL stacking the deck just like they did to Brisbane
    Sydney
    and Port Adelaide
    and West Coast Eagles
    Then you are kidding yourself, you try and justify watching a competition that has pre determined winners, and expect the people in Qld and NSW to swallow the cool aid and believe the tripe being dished out by the sport

    In terms of going over the cap have you even researched this? Brisbane Lions were fined $21k this year for being over the cap this year. St George were only fined $15k for their breach so the fines vary in both codes.
    Ever hear of the Melbourne Storm?
    here is your equivalent
    Sydney was fined the then-maximum $20,000 and stripped of a first-round draft pick after the first year when it was found to have paid out almost double the cap.
    In 1996 Essendon revealed it had breached the salary cap by $514,500 between 1991-96.
    Link
    The AFL said there was no doubt Carlton was guilty of paying players under the table and thus breaching the salary cap in 2000 and 2001.
    Link

    So are the punishments similar?


    The Council owns Carrara Stadium not the AFL.
    But the AFL have management rights, and passed them to the Suns, something not heard of in any other stadium in Australia



    In terms of the NRL clubs not lifting a finger to build a stadium that is probably why Skilled Park is so terribly built and does not reach international standards to host even a FIFA match.
    Skilled park has allready hosted an International game, when is your international game against the potato farmers? with a round ball soccer posts, and throwing LOL

    Maybe you could play the Kiwis at metricon LOL



    Oh also the stadium would basically have to be demolished to increase the size because of the way it has been built, oops.
    Maybe you should research this a bit better LOL


    The AFL tries to steer clear of being associated with media outlets from a business stand point but they are not immune either, the whole St Kilda school girl thing really tarnished the code a fair bit.
    This is what disgusts me about this code, it was not the medias fault 2 players and a manager had sex with an underage girl you friggin moron


    I just want to also point out I went to the Titans-Broncos first game this year at Skilled Park and then attended the Suns-Lions game later in the year and I can safely say the atmosphere at the AFL game was much better.
    That is because your a AFL fan, if you like hanging out with 70 year old ex victorians, screaming BALLLLLLL every 5 secs then all the power to you,

    Maybe you should give the Suns a go, your kids will be if they go through the school system here because of Auskick, a truly genius idea to win over the public from the kids upwards.
    Want some stats on participation numbers for touch football to Auskick?
    The difference is if someone plays Touch footy we dont claim they have NRL experience.
    Quote Originally Posted by Titus View Post
    When I am unable to respect and accept the decisions that are being made that directly affect my team, then I must take a backwards step.

  5. #50
    Super Moderator TITAN PETE's Avatar
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    Boom u just got owned Matchu , well done Coaster
    #itaintweaktospeak

  6. #51
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    LMAO, That response is pretty damn amusing, Coaster..

  7. #52
    QLD Cup Titan eelectrica's Avatar
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    Apparently the circus act known as the Suns got towelled up again

  8. #53
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    Anyone notice that the Suns have dropped nearly 10, 000 average attendance already this year?
    My sister lives back home in goldie, i live in Victoria now and i've seen more Suns (gurnseys?) than she has ahahaha!

    But really, we shouldn't laugh at the inferior product, lets be gracious in victory.
    AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA KIDDING!
    What jokes.

    Imagine them next year when they still suck and we're fielding a much better team.

    I predict a merger with the Brisbane Bears within 10 years. Bring on the Western Corridor bid or B2 so we can crush them faster.

    Go the Titans and F*&K THE SUNS!

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    Quote Originally Posted by TITAN PETE View Post
    Boom u just got owned Matchu , well done Coaster
    Far from it mate, if you read my post he only responded to the parts that he felt he could argue about. His arguments are weak and lack real substance or evidence. Lots of accusations being made without any real substance but living on the Gold Coast and listening to Rugby League fans my whole life I have gotten used to that.



    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Are you talking about the 3 premierships they were given?
    I couldnt watch a sport that is no better then the WWE. They stack the deck in favor of these so called expansion team so that they have success, how does that effect other AFL supporters from other clubs? Do you whinge about it, or just lap it up because Sir Vlad says so?
    I don't recall them handing premierships to Brisbane at the start of the season, if by getting handed you mean these advantages expansion clubs receive then you are way off. Two years earlier Fremantle entered the competition and still to this day have not won a premiership. It is true that they were given some advantages in terms of scheduling but nothing to warrant cheating premierships unlike a certain melbourne-based rugby league club I know of....

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Are you talking about the Lions? The same team that still exists today in Brisbane? The same team that was handed 3 premierships to keep there support base happy? and to drum up this massive following in Brisbane and capture all the kids imaginations? WTF happened?
    Yeah I am talking about the Fitzroy Lions Football Club. The team that still exists and plays in local football league in Victoria. This team in Brisbane is an amalgamation of both the 1996 Bears and Lions that formed a NEW footy club. Once the Brisbane Broncos started winning again (2006) the Lions struggled to compete with a traditional rugby league area having barely any results on the field since 2004. That is not to say they don't have support. Lions have 20,000 members and Broncos only have about 15,000 or so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Good work! a whole paragraph of teams and not 1 NRL team
    Don't know your history mate? Most of them played in the NRL at one point. Adelaide Rams folded after the 1998 NRL season, Gold Coast Chargers folded after the 1998 NRL season, North Sydney Bears folded after the 1999 NRL season, Newtown Jets left after the 1983 NSWRL season. The super league year saw the death of the South QLD Crushers, Hunter Mariners and Perth Reds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    South Melbourne relocated to Sydney Swans
    Brisbane Bears Merged with the Fitzroy Lions
    who the f*ck is Melbourne university?
    Such massive expansion into 2 of the top 3 biggest markets in Australia, relocation of Melbourne teams.
    Didn't say anything about relocations but if you want to get into that South Melbourne were the only ones. Melbourne University played in the AFL around 100 years ago and to this day are the only team to ever compete in the VFL/AFL and not still have a presence. They are still expanding into those markets. A team just started here and there is a team in West Sydney starting next year. The Brisbane Lions Football Club is not a Victorian club, they are a merger of a Victorian club and a Brisbane club to form a new Brisbane club. As I stated before the Fitzroy Football Club still exists.


    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Care to point me where i said Titans funded Skilled park?
    You were saying the AFL use their power to persuade the Government but the Titans did the same thing when Skilled Park was built.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Bullsh*t!
    Care to explain
    The only funding the QLD government that has been directed at the Suns was the redevelopment of Carrara which cost $144m. Skilled Park cost $160m. Looks like pretty straight forward maths to me. I would think the Government or the NRL would have paid for a lot of the Centre of Ex as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Does that figure include the extra funds given to players like Hunt?
    This is the biggest misconception about Karmichael. The Suns are paying him 250,000 a year (average AFL contract) and the AFL are paying him the 750,000 for his marketing which includes travelling around in Pacific Islands promoting the game in the off season.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Again does this include extra payments given to guys like Hunt? NO!
    Karmichael falls into an exception in the rules where if you have not played in the AFL or professionally at any level for 2 years and you get signed by an AFL side your salary falls outside of the salary cap.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Also how many extra draft picks do they get?
    If your too stupid to see the AFL stacking the deck just like they did to Brisbane
    Sydney
    and Port Adelaide
    and West Coast Eagles
    Then you are kidding yourself, you try and justify watching a competition that has pre determined winners, and expect the people in Qld and NSW to swallow the cool aid and believe the tripe being dished out by the sport
    They did it for Brisbane Bears where they gave them the first 6 draft picks and the team ended up failing so you can't say that worked. The Brisbane Lions were given normal draft picks in when they entered. Nothing changed when Sydney moved in 1982 and West Coast only received direct access to West Aussie players who played for WAFL clubs which is now called a zonal pick and still exists. This is the one that really pisses me off and makes me really know you have no idea because Port Adelaide were the direct losers of this when the Brisbane Lions received "advantages". Mate you have just quoted all the inter-state premiers in the last 10 years and just presumed it happened. DO THE RESEARCH. If it is all predetermined then please explain Geelong and Collingwood's success? If you say the draft then you are dead wrong because Richmond and Carlton should have both won a premiership by now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Ever hear of the Melbourne Storm?
    here is your equivalent
    Sydney was fined the then-maximum $20,000 and stripped of a first-round draft pick after the first year when it was found to have paid out almost double the cap.
    In 1996 Essendon revealed it had breached the salary cap by $514,500 between 1991-96.
    Link
    The AFL said there was no doubt Carlton was guilty of paying players under the table and thus breaching the salary cap in 2000 and 2001.
    Link

    So are the punishments similar?
    First of all that Sydney Swans incident occured in 1987. Secondly it was $60,000 not $20,000 and thirdly $60,000 was worth a lot more in 1987. The stuff you have quoted is all pretty old if you go a bit more recent (in the last 10 years) you'll see in 2003 the Brisbane Lions were fined $260,000 for late lodgement! The record is $987,000 to Carlton in 2002, so the AFL are not scared to fine clubs big amounts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    But the AFL have management rights, and passed them to the Suns, something not heard of in any other stadium in Australia
    The only reason they have management rights is because the AFL actually invested into the stadium. Something the NRL would never do because for some reason they don't like to support their clubs that make them billions of dollars. Where is the logic? I guess the NRL is based in Sydney that is notorious for being blood sucking.



    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Skilled park has allready hosted an International game, when is your international game against the potato farmers? with a round ball soccer posts, and throwing LOL
    There was supposed to be a Socceroos match in 2008 at Skilled Park and then... it didn't happen. The stadium doesn't reach international standards. Sure the RFL or ARL might see Skilled Park as okay but a real sporting body like FIFA won't touch it. You'll be unhappy to know they are actually playing the International Rules game against Ireland at Metricon this year. Something tells me it will sell out and you will be eating humble pie my friend.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Maybe you should research this a bit better LOL
    The stadium is semi-enclosed, the roof would have to be removed and it would cost a lot of money that the QLD government would be unlikely to give so close to when it was built. Where as Metricon is going to be upgraded to 40,000 when we get the Commonwealth Games in 2018.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    This is what disgusts me about this code, it was not the medias fault 2 players and a manager had sex with an underage girl you friggin moron
    I never said it was the media's fault? I was simply showing that the AFL doesn't have the cleanest name either.


    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    That is because your a AFL fan, if you like hanging out with 70 year old ex victorians, screaming BALLLLLLL every 5 secs then all the power to you,
    I do like AFL but once upon a time I was a massive Titans fan and attended about 7 games in 2008. You might notice I am a little bit more knowledgeable about Rugby League than your average AFL fan. It is because I used to be an NRL fan, look at when I joined this forum and look at my posts prior to 2010, you will clearly see I was an NRL fan. I have attended an NRL game this year and an AFL game and I am being completely honest about it but you will never accept what I say.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coaster View Post
    Want some stats on participation numbers for touch football to Auskick?
    The difference is if someone plays Touch footy we dont claim they have NRL experience.
    Touch footy is different, it is it's own sport. Has it's own governing body and hosts it's own world cup and everything. Get a look http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touch_f...(rugby_league).
    Last edited by Titan_Matchu; 07-08-11 at 02:30 PM.

  10. #55
    Administrator DIEHARD's Avatar
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    The code's showpiece in Queensland, the round 3 Q Clash, attracted a meagre crowd of 12,961 and a national audience of 83,500 viewers on the 7Mate digital channel.
    http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/...-1226626345757
    PUT EM TO THE SWORD! SHOW SOME STEEL!

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  11. #56
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    just read Titan_Matchu post lol havent laughed so hard in ages haha

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    I don't think anyone will be laughing at the Suns anymore. They seem to be in the box seat to win a lot of matches over the next few years. Will probably win a premiership before the Titans too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoastSportsFan View Post
    I don't think anyone will be laughing at the Suns anymore. They seem to be in the box seat to win a lot of matches over the next few years. Will probably win a premiership before the Titans too.
    Have they cracked 100 points in a game yet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoastSportsFan View Post
    I don't think anyone will be laughing at the Suns anymore. They seem to be in the box seat to win a lot of matches over the next few years. Will probably win a premiership before the Titans too.
    Is that you Clive? LOL
    PUT EM TO THE SWORD! SHOW SOME STEEL!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toads View Post
    Have they cracked 100 points in a game yet?
    Just looking through their history they have done it five times but have reach the 80s and 90s plenty of times. Don't know why there is so much animosity towards them unless you aren't from the Gold Coast? I, for one, want both Gold Coast teams to succeed and don't believe this BS the media spouts to us about hating codes. Support your community or we'll lose even more teams like the Blaze and Gold Coast United.


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